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spending in order to reduce trillion dollar deficits and a national debt that is now mind-boggling league not -- monotonous. house minority leader disagrees vehemently with the speaker on how to reduce deficits and debt. today she offered a paradoxical statement on fiscal policy that would make both casey stiegel and yogi berra proud. the nation now just 24 days away from $600 billion of spending cuts and tax increases that will automatically kicked in. and pelosi has some wise words for washington. please listen terror. >> this is a moment of truth. the clock is ticking. christmas is coming. the goose is getting fat. in many homes across america it is very, very lean times. you cannot cut your way to deficit reduction. lou: that's right. pelosi says we cannot get our way to deficit reduction. listen to the top democrat in the house of representatives, the former speaker of the house unveiling -- on dealing with the fiscal crisis one more time. >> in many homes across america ad is a very, very lean time. you cannot cut your way to deficit reduction. lou: today said minority leader appear
months noctober and november... the deficit, almost $300 billion, $4.8 billion a day. they had $30 billion in revenue. but the spending is up 3 times that much, $87 billion. how do woe stop the out-of- control spending? how can we get the budget deficit under control? can we do that for our children and grandchildren? >> we don't cut back on medicare and social security benefits that impact middle-class and working families. we start with the rich. that's what the voters wanted. they don't want -- middle-class families like mine, they don't want to see their taxes go up $2200 after january 1. they want to keep the tax deductions that they have and allow for people who can afford it to pay down some of this debt and deficit-- >>> trey -- [overlapping dialogue] >> eric: how do we pay this down? >> eric, what you are hearing is very unfortunate because you asked a specific question about cutting spending, democrats will not talk about it. she won't talk about it right now. -- >>> that's not my question. how do we stop the spending? >> how we stop the spenning is to over the dlif and h
campaigned for re-election on the idea of a, quote, balanced approach, end quote, to deficit reduction, a mixture of tax increases and spending cuts. here's the plan that the republicans say you presented to them. >> i can tell you what i presented. it will be helpful. >> chris: let me -- >> it is our plan, let me do it. let me explain it. >> chris: i'd like to ask you about this part of it and you can tell me. >> okay. >> chris: $1.6 trillion in tax increases. more than $80 billion in new stimulus spending, next year, and, unspecified nonguaranteed spending cuts. question, is that your idea of balance. >> it is, let me explain what is in the explain they didn't report to you and explain, to people, which is, we propose alongside the trillion dollars in spending cuts we agreed with republicans, last year, on defense and a range of other government programs, proposed $600 billion of detailed reforms and savings, to our health care and other government programs, that is $600 billion. in fact, the health care savings in that plan, are larger than the plans we have seen republicans in the
, to deficit reduction. a mixture of tax increases and spending cuts. here's the plan that the republicans say you presented to them this week. >> i can tell you what i presented if it would be helpful. >> let me ask you. >> but it's our plan. why don't you let me do t why don't you let me explain it. >> well, i would like to ask you about this part of it and then anything i leave out you can tell me. 1.$6 trillion in tax increases, more than $80 billion in new stimulus spending next year, and an unspecified nonguaranteed spending cuts. question, is that your idea of balance? >> it is. let me explain what is in this plan that they didn't report to you and they didn't explain to people, which is we have proposed alongside the trillion dollars in spending cuts, we agreed with republicans last year on defense and other range ever programs, we proposed $600 billion of detailed reforms and savings to our healthcare and medicare programs. that's $600 billion. in fact, the healthcare savings in that plan are larger than the plans we've seen republicans in the past. >> is that what was in the budget?
to prosperity or to cut our way out of this deficit problem that we have. we're going to need more revenues. in order to do that, that starts with higher rates for the folks at the top. >> reporter: the president did say today he would consider lowering rates again for the top two percent next year as part of a broader tax overhaul. the house republican plan envisions $2.2 trillion in deficit reductions over the next decade. $800 billion would come from new revenues but with no hike in tax rates for top earners. instead the plan relies on $1.2 trillion in reduced spending including $600 billion from changes in medicare and medicaid. at the white house today, the president met with a bipartisan group of governors pressing his own plan for deficit reduction. that proposal, $1.6 trillion in revenue from tax increases on the wealthy and $600 billion in spending cuts mostly from reductions in medicare. he also wants authority to raise the debt ceiling without congressional intervention. but governors emerged afterwards treading a line between the two sides. delaware governor jack markel, a democ
're serious about reducing our deficit, while still investing in things like education and research that are important to growing our economy, and if we're serious about protecting middle class families, we're also going to have to ask the wealthiest americans to pay higher tax rates. that's one wrins pal i won't compromise on. >> good saturday morning to you, mike. >> hi, alex. >> let's talk about the time line. is there a realistic one in which this can all get done by the beginning of the year? >> i think there is, alex. i think people know the parameters of the year. it's just can they get there, do they have the political will to get there. more importantly, alex, do they have the votes to get there in the house of representatives. you heard the president. he says no compromise on this issue of raising taxes for the wealthy. there's one glimmer of hope, how much to hike taxes. as you know, clinton tax rates for wealthiest americans were 39.6%. that's what's going to happen at the beginning of the year. right now they are 35%. the president has been insisting all along those rat
is to go over the fiscal cliff. it maximizing the deficit reduction. there's no deal cut between republicans and democrats. it's not going to reduce the amount of money coming out of the deficit by a lot. so if you do that, you go back to the clinton tax rates, cut some defense and we have a short, mild recession for two quarters. we have to get serious about the deficit e. i have no belief that the congress is going to get serious about the deficit. so tom cole was right because he wants to get the republicans back in the mainstream. but the best thing the country could do is go over the cliff. >> timothy geithner doesn't agree with you on that. >> he may or may not. but i looked at this a lot of ways. the people inside washington are awfully smart and awfully out of touch. we need to do something about the deficit. going over the fiscal cliff is the best thing we're going to get out of washington in terms of serious production to the deficit. we will suffer, but we got ourselves into this. we're not going to get out without some pain. i think we are going to go over the cliff.
by market opinion. we'll take stock of britain's progress towards deficit reduction, this ahead of the chancellor's autumn statement. senior fellow for international economics. will the numbers live up to the expectations. meanwhile, over in ghi narks the mainland's factories are crank out more goods at the fastest pace in month. >> chinese factories appear to be recovering. the hsbc pmi, a private gauge of manufacturing, and the government's official pmi, both show a steady improvement for the industry in november. the hsbc pmi final reading came in at 50.5, the quickest expansion in over a year. the industry saw a pick up in new orders as well as stronger exports thanks in part to christmas demand. the concern is about the the unevenness of the recovery. the sub indices for employment as well as small and medium sized companies ticked downwards and that suggested to some that the recovery is mainly led by investment in state-owned enterprises. a bigger worry is about the outlook for external demand especially in the united states. people here are worried about the fiscal cliff
the deficit we have. the truth is, if you want to balance the budget, which i do, you have to have increased revenues and you have significant spending cuts. and you have said many times on this program that raising taxes on rich people is not enough to deal with the deficit. you are right. the truth is, the best thing we could do is go over the fiscal cliff. we have the same tax rates that we have when bill clinton was president. significant cuts in defense and also significant human services can you tell us. >> katie, let me ask you, before you respond to what governor dean is saying. there is logic to what howard dean is saying. i don't happen to agree with it. but i know where he's coming from. katie, let me ask you this -- katie can't hear me. we'll wait for her to get back hooked in. howard, what about the notion that i'm posing tonight -- i've said this a few times -- republicans better be careful. they're not going down your road and the democrats aren't going down your road. you have middle class tax cuts for the democrats and it sometimes sounds to me as an old reagan conservative
on the left vigorously opposed. >> the thing that is driving the horrendous deficit and debt problem are the federal healthcare programs. medicare, medicaid, tri care and related medical health programs. >> future deficits only make tax cuts even more contentious. any bill that permanently increases the deficit requires 60 votes in the senate. and these days, anything with the word "tax" in it, makes it hard to round up 60 votes. bret? >> bret: definitely. jim, thank you. >> you bet. >> bret: so do you think the white house and lawmakers will beat the deadline or is not let me know on twitter. you follow me@bretbaeir. republicans make a counter offer to get off the fiscal cliff. we have talk about it. what's in it. the president's response. the fox all-stars. they're next. [ male announcer ] you like who you are... and you learned something along the way. this is the age of knowing what you're made of. so, why let erectile dysfunction get in your way? talk to your doctor about viagra. 20 million men already have. ask if your heart is healthy enough for sex. do not take viagra if you
, for which we're responsible. there is a $1 trillion -- $1.04 trillion deficit this year, fifth year in a row we have this kind of number. we're going to, as folks used to say when i was a young fellow, this country's going to hell in a hand basket if we don't get our act together. >> and right now, we still have time. dollar's not falling. we don't have treasury bond yields soaring through the roof lou: the euro is rising against the dollar. isn't that embarrassing? >> that's not a concern to the administration or congress. lou: we should say to hell with the sound dollar. let's em brails strong competitiveness. last i looked at the trade deficit, we were, again, lagging and uke sucking popped water. there's a rising deficit stripping our gdp. >> and right now europe is in a relatively deep recession. we're still above water. lou: you jumped all over the punch line because you talk about things not making sense. folks, this is not making sense. i'm delighted because people have wealth left in the equities market, the bond market. how long will that be the case if we go over the cliff? >> won
't raise enough taxes to completely deal witthe deficit. and you do have to do reforms. you need to reform the tax system. you certainly need to make additional cuts. i do want to remind you though, that we have already voted on one trillion dollars of cuts, cuts that would cause great pain. i agree what you 100%. it can not be done. melissa: spending cutting numbers are even smaller than the tax numbers. they don't get us there either. i'm worried about stalling the economy. in the meantime when we talk about raising taxes and what it would do to small business. democrats like to point out we would only raise taxes on 3% of small business owners. >> right. melissa: but that 3% generates 50% of the inme from small business. so they're hiringhe majori of people. to me that is going to cost us jobs. >> well,ou know what? i think that what will cost us jobs for sure is if we go off thissfiscal cliff, because it is not just about ising tacks. it is also about the debt ceiling. it is about unemployment insurance. we have number of key issues that absolutely have to be resolved byythe end of the
in australia. pretty cool. >>> well, a new campaign that's meant to raise awareness about the deficit crisis, is getting lots of buzz. >> it calls on young folks to get serious about the deficit, and it stars former senator, alan simpson. >> stop instagraming your breakfast and tweeting your problems. and getting on youtube so you can see "gangnam style." >> he's got the moves. >> you go ahead, boy. >> 81-year-old alan simpson, right there, kicking it gangnam style. the can kicks back, a play on kicking the can down the road. that's simpson of simpson-bowles. >> that was the commission working to reduce the deficit. there's your commission chairman. whatever gets folks' attention, right? the work not in vain. there's your chairman. looking good, allen. break it down. looks good in everything. >>> you know those dog owners who swear that fido really genuinely is pretty smart. >> let's not offend all of the dog owners. they are smart. >> look at this. some proof here. experts are teaching dogs how to drive. they say it took only eight weeks for the canines to master the basics. >> it's part of
for a deficit deal, president obama pressed his case at the home of a middle class family in virginia today, part of his pitch to extend tax cuts for all but the very wealthy. good evening, i'm jeffrey brown. >> woodruff: and i'm judy woodruff. on the "newshour" tonight, we update the state of the negotiations and examine the push to make changes to social security and medicare. >> brown: then, margaret warner looks at the political strife in egypt, after deadly clashes in the streets and resignations by top officials. >> woodruff: we have a battleground dispatch from a coastal city facing rising sea levels and the next big storm. >> if sandy were to come close r directly into norfolk i think we'd all be in big trouble. >> brown: we assess the latest diplomatic moves to end syria's war, as secretary of state hillary clinton meets with russia's foreign minister. >> woodruff: and ray suarez has the story of a program that aims to put students at low-achieving schools on a path to high school graduation. >> we're here to make things better. we're here to tutor kids. we're here to make sure tha
. we have been talking about a snow deficit over the last several weeks. look at some of these departures ahead of the storm system. still very mild. in the 70s in little rock and the 50sin columbus ohio. behind it, much colder. >> maria, thanks. >>> coming up, our first look at the british nurse that is caught in a prank on the royal family. and prince william and kate devastated after that nurse is believed to have taken her own life. and now the not so funny prank backfiring on the pranksters. >> and the star of a wildly popular song hitting a sour note, now apologizing for comments he made about the united states just days before he is set to meet with president obama. and a new factor complicating efforts to reach a deal over the fiscal cliff. the president needs to make the next move. >> it is not going to help our economy, and it is not going to help those seeking work. i came out to put revenues on the table and to take a step toward the president to resolve this. when is he going take a step toward us? >>> welcome back and time for a quick check of the head lo
income tax cuts. the republicans say the plan cuts the deficits by $4.6 trillion based on the white house method of counting based on the recommendations of the president's deficit reduction commission but the president could disagree. the republicans say the plan would raise $800 million through tax reform but not by phasing out the upper income bush tax cuts and before the plan was announced, white house press secretary insisted the rates will not make it to the new year. >> he will not sign a bill that extends those tax rates for the top 2 percent. we cannot afford it. it is not wise economic policy. not wise fiscal policy. it would defeat the principle of balance that he has embraced. >> the president wrapped up an hour long twitter session promoting what he called a balanced approach, as far as deficit reduction. >>shepard: is this posturing? >>reporter: well, it is, this great measure. each side wants to blame the other. and not just if we go over the cliff, but if they do reach an agreement, each side wants the other to take the blame for the parts of the ultimate compromise their
buffett and all his pals, it will pay off obama's 2011 deficit in the year 2520 circumstance, in 514 years time, and then we'll need the next half millenium to pay off his 2012 deficit. >> i think the republicans were sent there with a mandate as well as president. obviously the american people voted for the status quo. they voted for divided government. here's the question i have. i would no want them to think os and grand hides and the slem hammer we're robbing them with. if obama wants to take the country off the fiscal cliff, they need to go there. they seem afraid of that. do you see that. >> it's clear from the election that the majority of americans essentially voted for european levels of spending. you can't have european levels of spending. we're one percent under canada. there's no difference any more, not in terms of government spending. we're close to norway. we're not quite to sweden yet, but we basically are spending like europeans, but we're not taxed like that. the idea that you can close that gap, i think he figured out if he can make this level of spending permanent, he c
the tax increase he wants the country would be facing trillion dollar deficits. >> this isn't a progress report because there is in progress to report. when it comes to the fiscal cliff threatening our economy and jobs the white house has wasted another week. >>reporter: he calls officials saying they are ready to go over the trip. >>shepard: democrats insist that revenue, revenue, revenue is the key. >>guest: president obama campaigned on it and obviously won and democrats insist upper income americans should pay higher taxes but there could be room to negotiate but their point is they don't want to talk about other aspects of a deal until the g.o.p. gives in on their demand for more tax money. >> what is lacking are the revenues. we cannot cut your way to deficit reduction. what reduces the deficit are jobs. job creation. after spending cuts, and medicare saving, and next is the revenue. >>reporter: leader pelosi spent time at the white house today meeting with president obama on what we are told are a number of issues. >>shepard: thank you, mike, from washington, dc. we know that busi
? if it is to reduce the deficit, it won't happen because if they take that money it, may run the government for 8 days. so we're not talking about an amount of money that's really going to fundamentally change either the ability to fund government or reduce the deficit. is it because he wants to punish people at the top? why? what is that to him? that doesn't help people at the bottom. if it did, then it could be justified. and i guess the president has yet to explain other than the fair share if you think about it top 10% pay a 7% of all the federal taxes so what is a fair share? >> geraldo: but that is what he campaigned on isn't that in itself its own justification be it -- albeit that it is 8 days out of 365? >> i think what he campaigned on certainly thats with a one of the things that he hammered of but hes said he was going to get the federal deficit down and federal spending under will cro. he said he was going to take on freely transparent. talk about a president who has broken campaign promises. what he needs to understand that his job is not it campaign anymore. find something that can be a
're running a trillion dollar deficit year single year. if we went back to zero, we're rebalanced. right now with the fourth year in a row, that deficit and debt continues to climb. so it doesn't really wipe it out and the challenge of it is what does that do to the overall economy. we're not just dealing with one tax increase as well. a lot of people lose track of that. the affordable care about actually begin on january 1st as well for people making $200,000 or more. or people having large medical bills. this is talking about an additional tax increase on top of that. >> what about what bill clinton said? he said once things start to get better and that's a crucial point he was making. once the economy starts to get better, taxes have to go up on the middle class. do you agree? is. >> i don't, actually. and the reason being is that right now, if you look at the real math, in 2007 and 012, we have the same amount of revenue. now, 2008 and 2009, we had a dramatic drop in federal revenues, but we've slowly climbed back up. revenue has gone up every year of the obama administration and now, we
is that at a minimum, any deficit package has to include this immediate february and march debt ceiling that we're going to hit. >> is jack lew the current chief of staff and former budget director the top candidate to be treasury? what is your best guess? >> he appears to be the frontrunner from everything you see and read and hear and he is a -- i've known him a long time. he's an accomplished guy. he knows these issues perfectly. he has worked in the financial community and has a sense of that and vice versa. and so i think he would be a it terrific choice. >> we should say there are a couple other people who have been rumored to being vetted. roger altman, former treasury official, larry fink, be erskine bowles. this what is alan simpson, erskine bowles' partner in the deficit commission, had to say about that possibility last week on the show. >> he said he would be very pleased to do that. he shared that with me personally, as long as they move the treasury department to north carolina, to charlotte. i don't think -- >> he's worked so hard on this. you don't think he could be persuaded? >
adds so much to the federal budget deficit. so republicans say raise the retirement age to 67 or means testing, meaning making more wealthy americans pay more into the system or get less out of the system. if you means test, that means you're paying less out to affluent americans. if you raise the retirement age, you're paying out less as money comes in and keeping the revenue line closer to the cost line. that is the goal. so when you do a 10 or 20-year calculation, medicare is not adding to the deficit. but that's the policy and just as republicans are having a backlash against the speaker saying we don't think we should put tax increases on the table, the democrats and some of the new members in congress, they say they ran promising not to touch medicare. so they say they won't do this. so you have the credibility challenge. republicans say give us entitlement and other spending cuts and the democrats want higher tax rates. that's why we have a stalemate. >>> an internet icon wanted in connection with the killing of his neighbor. stay with us, you're in "the situation room." that of
of the entire group of government spending programs that are being looked at to get to deal with the deficits? >> well, before i answer that i was very interested in the way you characterized these programs as entitlements. so-called, you said, entitlements. and we think that a better term would be earned benefits. you know, i counted the letters in the word "entitlement." there are 11 letters. often people refer to entitlement as a four-letter word and it's a derogatory, derisive characterization. these are earned benefits. people pay for them while they're working, social security part "a" medicare, the hospital part. 25% of the premium for part "b." so i wish we would switch from entitlements to earned benefits, first of all. now answer your question, social security has not added a penny to the federal debt, to the deficits every year. it has a surplus. it has a surplus of $2.7 trillion. so why are we in such a rush to change a program that does not have -- is not bankrupt, has a surplus, has 22 years of solvency before it does have a serious problem and has not contributed to the federal
it's not 17% of our debt because right now we have a trillion dollar deficit every single year. if we went back to zero, that's true. right now with fourth year in a row with over a trillion dollars in deficit spending, that deficit and debt continues it to climb. it doesn't wipe it out. what does it do to the overall economy. we're not just dealing with one tax increase right now. the affordable care act actually begin on january 1st as well for people making $200,000 or more or people with large medical bills. that already starts coming up. this is an additional tax increase on top of that tax increase. >> what about what bill clinton said? he said once things start to get better, and that's a crucial point he was making. he wasn't saying doing it right away. once it gets better, taxes go up on the middle class. do you agree with that? >> i don't, actually. the reason being is that right now if you look at the real math on it, in 2007 and 2012 we have the same amount of revenue. obviously 2008 and '09 we had a dramatic drop in federal revenues coming in. we've slowly climbed back up
a plan not just to avert the fiscal cliff, but importantly to really tackle the deficit and debt problems in this country. i am concerned that deal won't be big enough. is it going to be small or medium or big. we need a plan big enough to fix the deficit problems and make sure the debt is no longer growing faster than the economy. we're not going to be able to balance the budget in the near future because the fiscal hole is so big. you want to make sure the debt is not growing faster than the economy. that's going to take $4 trillion in savings. you need all parts on the table and constructed in a thoughtful way so that revenues are raised in ways that are good for the economy as possible, and that when we're looking at the spending in the budget, we reform our entitlement programs and reduce spending in way that's thoughtful and good for the economy. it's going to take a lot to get there, but i actually think most of the policy ideas are well known and we're now in this political negotiation where i think there's a lot of support for having them, if they're going to go through all this,
on the highest 2%, you cannot generate enough revenue for deficit reduction. unfortunately, the changes in the tax code, which is republicans want to turn to will increase taxes and cut tax deductions for the middle class americans. >> all right. joining me now, contributing editor for the daily beast. we just heard from democratic senator there. does that sound like any progress has been made? as we talk about 23 days, that doesn't take into account we are looking at december 21st. if you happen to watch that on television, it looks like both sides are hardening. the cement is getting thicker. there's a growing recognition on the republican side that they have lost the debate over the higher tax rates and that those rates will go up. and there are lots of other tax increases that aren't getting the public attention. the rate at which capital gains are taxed. the rate that is paid on dividend income. i'm stumbling over my words because i don't have a lot in that category. i think the republicans are willing to move there and there's money there. the president has been more forthcoming o
, and the deficit. >> it's 35 degrees on this thursday morning. next, an unusual decision by judge. >> which of two people with a criminal past deserved to go to annapolis to represent prince george's county? greg good morning and welcome back. right now we are little busy on the maryland beltway. not seeing any delays for now but prepare for the morning rush-hour. this is footage from a tractor- trailer that overturned loaded with boxes of pineapples. leaving college park and to 270 the right lane will be blocked the entire morning rush hour. they're waiting for a truck to offload the boxes. john gonzalez will have more details later. but the right lane will be blocked through the morning rush hour. after 9:00 we will try to get that back on its wheels. how about the forecast? >> 36 degrees. it is cold this morning. the big chill has returned to the metro area. you can feel the difference with the north wind at 13 miles an hour. 30 degrees at dulles, 27 in gaithersburg. 28 degrees in hagerstown, 23 in frederick. temperatures between 25 degrees and 35 degrees colder than this time yesterday morning
to the white house press secretary says, look, the whole thing here is not about deficit reduction, listen. >> deficit reduction in and of itself is not the goal here. the reason to get our fiscal house in order. the reason to pass a deficit reduction package that is balanced and allows for economic growth and job creation is to put our economy on a sustainable fiscal path, which, then itself produces positive economic benefits and growth and jobs. >> okay. so here's the problem with that jay carney speaking for the president. speaking for the president, president obama, think back a couple years ago, in fact, it was october of 2008 when he was senator obama wanting to be president obama. he was concerned about the deficit and the debt. listen to what he had to say back then. >> the problem is the way bush has done it over the last 8 years is to take out a credit card from the bank of china in the name of our children, driving up our national debt from $5 trillion from the first 42 presidents, number 43 ed a $4 trillion by his lonesome so we now have over $9 trillion of debt that we're goi
overwhelming the deficit story was at that point. you know, you look at that administration. the coming in, just no one thought they could do anything. it's not unlike the conversations we're having now. and they went in, they did the deal, president bush had to shift from read my lips to as only he could put it, read my hips. and it was good for the country, it created a political dynamic that cost president bush the election in 1992, and which we're still living, because that gave us grover norquist, et cetera. >> let's get to grover norquist in a minute, but i do have a question. the gop plan consists of $2.2 trillion in savings over a decade. that includes raging the eligibility age for medicare from 65 to 67. and lowering cost of living increases for social security benefits. they also propose overhauling the tax code to generate $800 billion in new revenue. but without raising taxes on the wealthy. in a letter to the president, leading republicans compared their plan to one erskine bowles drew up last year. >> not even close. >> he rejected that connection and the white house, of cou
. >> what the president has said is we need $1.6 trillion as part of an overall deficit reduction plan, because if you don't get those additional revenues, but you also try and reduce the deficit, you end up whacking everybody else much harder. and so, it's really important to have that revenue number as high as possible. >> sure. >> look, the president's already been clear, ed. on cuts, he will continue to implement over the next ten years over $1 trillion in cuts that he agreed to as part of the budget control act, 100% cuts. and at the time, he said we've got to come back and do revenue. he "life & style weeklalso call billion in cuts and laid out exactly what those should be. >> catch "the ed show" here at 8:00 p.m. eastern on msnbc, the place for politics. >>> well, new jersey governor chris christie is making a personal plea for federal disaster aid in the wake of hurricane sandy. the republican governor paid an unannounced visit to the white house to ask the president for $83 billion in aid for new jersey, new york and connecticut. he also met with members of congress. it was th
Search Results 0 to 49 of about 173 (some duplicates have been removed)